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Lisbon Treaty???

 
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Tommy
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Joined: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 1049
Location: New York

PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 10:45 pm    Post subject: Lisbon Treaty??? Reply with quote

Alright, I must admit, I am completely lost here. I went here and found nothing but a load of overly vague jargon. Then I found this news article with 190 pages of comments, which I read through entirely. Many of the comments where people voted no stated that they did not understand the treaty and voted no. Now, many people slagged them for this but to me, this made sense. Some treaty that could decide how your country is run in the future by foreign powers is not being clearly explained or outlined in such a fashion so that it makes sense - hell yes vote no until its drawn out more clearly. Now, from the sky news link, the people that called these people idiots for voting no when they did not understand what they were voting for, could not present any good reason for their own yes vote which leads me to think they have no clue either.

What are the good and bad points for Ireland here? I have read that there was propaganda being dispersed that stated a yes vote would mean legalized prostitution, legalized drugs, abortion, etc. I also read that we would not have representation for 5 out of 15 years. There also seems to be a lot of talk about where this leaves Ireland in the EU and even where does this leave the EU as a whole.

Anyway, if you have clear and informative information, pros and cons, please post it up along with source links if you have them.
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dave mc
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Joined: 25 Jun 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

still haven't bothered to register to vote so.... didn't...

any newspapers (the free ones they hand out at the train station) were very biased so i'd no idea who to vote for.

Although Martin clarified things for me on friday night..

if we voted yes... and england started a war... we'd have to help them!!
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Tommy
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Joined: 22 Sep 2003
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Location: New York

PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dave mc wrote:
still haven't bothered to register to vote so.... didn't...

any newspapers (the free ones they hand out at the train station) were very biased so i'd no idea who to vote for.

Although Martin clarified things for me on friday night..

if we voted yes... and england started a war... we'd have to help them!!

Strange thing about that Sky News link is that many Brits posted their thanks to the Irish for voting no. Would really like to know why they were so against it but no one really seemed to say or know why. Get Martin on here...Edward too if you can.
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Chris
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Joined: 21 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tommy, like yourself, I read up on the matter. I read a booklet at work, a small booklet that came in the door, and every other leaflet I received that was for and against and even went to the official site that was supposed to explain WHAT exactly the Lisbon treaty was and how it would affect countries signing up to it. The result?? None the wiser! All the text was ambiguous, like salesman talk trying to swindle you into voting for it without actually telling you what you are buying into! The only thing that stuck in my head from all the gobbledegook (there's a word you dont use everyday!), was the fact that if the Lisbon Treaty was passed, and a major law was to be voted on, they only needed 15 out of 27 countries to vote FOR it in order to pass it. To me, thats NOT democracy. Never mind the fact that the UK, Germany and 1 other country were going to have more position and power than the rest of us. I dont blame the people of Ireland for voting No... Maybe the treaty WASNT made clear enough because it would have highlighted exactly where your power would be, and most people wouldnt be happy at major decisions being made over and above Ireland and the population just having to put up with it... (Just my 2 cents)
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Tommy
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Joined: 22 Sep 2003
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Location: New York

PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I foudn this to be a good read but it only lists possible downsides to the Lisbon Treaty. That said though, many of these would be hard to live with.
http://www.no2lisbon.ie/media/LisbonAlternativeGuide1.pdf
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